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Conversation | 05/20/2008 10:29 am

At a Table in So-Called Liberal NYC, Woman Announces: I’ll Never Vote for a Black Man for President

© AP

Editor’s Note: Featuring Kathleen Jamieson, director of the Annenberg Public Policy Center, a professor of communications and the former dean of the Annenberg School for Communication at the University of Pennsylvania.

LESLEY: So I’m so glad that you all could join us today. Liz Smith, obviously we know who Liz Smith is; Kathleen Hall Jamieson, Director of the Annenberg Public Policy Center at the University of Pennsylvania and an expert on campaigns; and we are blessed with Candice Bergen. Let’s get started right off the bat, discussing the topic du jour, the campaign. Actually it’s the topic of every day. But let’s talk about the three “isms”: racism, sexism and ageism, starting with racism. Here’s my question: It has for long, I think, been that racism is a hidden issue. If voters made decisions because of race, they often lied to pollsters. It was kind of shameful. Do any of you get the feeling that that is changing, ever since the Rev. Wright issue exploded? Do you have a feeling that people are more willing to openly admit that they won’t vote for Obama because of race? Kathleen, are you picking up any of this?

Click here to read Part Two: Percentage of Voters Say They Would Never Vote for a Woman, Regardless of Qualifications.

Click here to read Part Three: Who Says Older Ages Equal Serious Health Problems?

KATHLEEN: Well, we’re seeing it in surveys. We’re seeing a percent of the population that doesn’t say it wouldn’t, but does say it would be less likely, or that race is a factor in vote. And then when you parse the question by saying, “Is race increasing or decreasing the likelihood of your vote?” what you actually see is, it’s increasing likelihood for some and decreasing likelihood for others. And then you have to ask, “And then what do those two things mean and how do we parse all that back into our history?”

LESLEY: But are people more willing to admit this than ever before? Or is it just a feeling one gets?

KATHLEEN: I don’t think we know whether they’re more willing because, in the past, we haven’t framed the question that way. And so I think it’s a great question and I don’t think we have an answer.

LIZ: If you look at The New York Times from Monday, it looks like America has racism pretty much under control when Obama can draw 75,000 people to a rally in Oregon. That’s just an incredible picture. The enthusiasm for that is incredible. Of course … that means nothing.

LESLEY: Liz, you and I went to a very fancy-schmancy dinner party in New York the other night. And a woman at our table, in so-called liberal New York City, announced to our table that she would never vote for a black to be in the White House. That’s what she said. And everybody else at the table was shocked and started to yell at her. But she felt perfectly comfortable saying that.

LIZ: Well, I was just glad nobody overturned the table …

LESLEY: Well, they wanted to. But the point is … I hear it more. That’s why I’m asking this question.

KATHLEEN: Lesley, when you hear it, do people then give you some reason? It seems to me that saying that should be unacceptable unless one has a reason. And I can’t think of a reason that could legitimize that conclusion.

LESLEY: What I was wondering is, does that mean that the Rev. Wright issue changed peoples’ attitudes in a way that it’s no longer as shameful for some people?

LIZ: Yeah, that’s a very good point, Lesley. I think that’s true. But, honestly, this woman the other night that you refer to at our dinner, that is the first overt thing I’ve ever had anybody say in my presence in – honestly — in years. So maybe today people are more politically correct; but privately they may be something else.

182 Reader Comments (so far…) Sign In or Register to comment

Frannie Em
Patricia, The internment of the Japanese in WWII was on of the worst things that FDR did. I am always amazed by that, and that he wouldn’t push for civil rights because he needed the southern vote for the war. Wasn’t Truman the first to make that an issue? Late and trying to remember my history. In CA up hiway 395 there is the museum of a large internment camp. Empty, vast and dry, there is also a museum. Very interesting how they kept their spirit and wills engaged.
By Frannie Em on 05/22/2008 1:06 am
Mugsy Peabody
The black soldiers and many white soldiers coming back from WWII were the catalysts for change, as well as the Rosie the Riveter women who worked alongside other races in the shipyards and other manufacturing plants, and of course as always getting to know people is the key to disarming ignorance. The Japanese Internment is also one of the great stories of American courage and dignity in the face of an impossible situation. Tule Lake and Manzanar in California held nearly 30,000 people who had been driven from their homes and forced to sell their businesses, land, and other possessions on short notice; and yet they lived peaceably together in very difficult, dehumanizing circumstances, and, after the war, came back into society and began again, rebuilding their lives from scratch, just as so many other Americans have done over the history of this country, with little understanding or support.
By Mugsy Peabody on 05/22/2008 3:55 am
Frannie Em
Mugsy 5:21 Ignorance is the problem. Ignorance with another big dollop of ignorance on top.
By Frannie Em on 05/22/2008 1:10 am
Brooklyn Gal
Why leave the table when you can explore the issue? Especially with 2 journalists at the same table. Wasn’t the Duchess of Windsor, a sought after socialite, also a pro-Nazi activist?
By Brooklyn Gal on 05/20/2008 6:24 pm
Mugsy Peabody
And Jessica Mitford, our adored Oakland communist writer’s sister dated Hitler. The Mitfords must have had some interesting family dinners. Gandhi was reputed to beat his wife. Nobody is a saint, not even the saints, you know? That’s why we’re here on this planet in this lifetime, to work on our stuff. I just have problems with the ones who don’t think they have anything to work on.
By Mugsy Peabody on 05/20/2008 7:44 pm
Lena B
There has been a white man in the White House since 1789. African American men gained the right to vote in 1870. Women gained the right to vote in 1920. Why is it inconceivable that America is not willing to admit that race IS an issue? If it were not, there would be more diversity in the presidency over the history of our country. That woman at the table was being honest, repugnant but honest. I find it very disingenuous for someone who feels like her to hide it. At this point, generations of African Americans have something to be very proud of. We recognize that there are more people like that woman even in 2008. Racism is a cancer. It is my prayer that this moment in history will cause those who hold racist beliefs to question the legitimacy of those beliefs.
By Lena B on 05/20/2008 6:33 pm
T S
Beautifully stated, Lena. Illuminating comments. :)
By T S on 05/20/2008 9:40 pm
Lena B
Thanks T S! (smile)
By Lena B on 05/23/2008 7:53 pm
Buh- Bye
I suppose if history is any indicator, we are again being informed by the pant brigade that women will have to wait another 50 years for our turn. Unfortunately I’ll be dead, so I’ll miss the danged milestone.
By Buh- Bye on 05/20/2008 7:03 pm
mary lou s
since i miss her, i will give suzanne de cornelia’s previous reply to this sort of comment: “plus de drapeaux”
By mary lou s on 05/21/2008 1:30 pm
K O
You’re a erudite and thoughtful person. I’m so glad you took the time to express that eloquent position.
By K O on 05/20/2008 7:11 pm
Lena B
Sister Kitty, If you were complimenting me, I am sincerely appreciative. You chose a beautiful word that I didn’t know, I had to look it up, “erudite”. Thank you (smile)
By Lena B on 05/20/2008 9:38 pm
bean
The *I am woman* routine bores me and is phoney. Condi Rice would NOT get this kind of support if she were running. AND Micheal Steele would NOT get this kind of support if he were running. Sooo it is not a Race issue or a black issue-it is a liberal/socialist/hate America issue.
By bean on 05/20/2008 8:17 pm
Mugsy Peabody
And what bores me is the phoney baloney knee-jerk crap you post — how about just for the hell of it getting real for a change, bean? Liberals don’t hate America. In fact, many liberals have actually read the Bill of Rights and the United States Constitution. Socialism is a school of political thought. It has nothing to do with hatred, but is, rather, a theory about the organization of society. The “I am woman” routine is one of the most real social movements of the past three centuries. Who the hell knows what support Condi Rice would get were she to run? She said she doesn’t want to. I don’t know Mr. Steele, and I have no idea what he would do, but I suspect you don’t speak for him. Why not knock off the “I am bumpersticker” routine and talk about your experience with life? Might be fun. Who knows?
By Mugsy Peabody on 05/20/2008 8:26 pm
Brooklyn Gal
And, I can’t imagine Republicans supporting Condi who represents the failed Bush policies. Republicans can’t even win seats in states that usually vote Republican. However, I think many Dems would vote for Colin Powell.
By Brooklyn Gal on 05/20/2008 9:14 pm