Conversation | 02/12/2009 10:45 am

Lesley Stahl on Men: The More Romantic Sex?

Lesley joins Liz Smith and Cynthia McFadden to debate the merits of Valentine’s Day, seduction and those red, satin hearts

With Cynthia McFadden, Lesley Stahl and Liz Smith

QUESTION: What are you all doing for Valentine’s Day?

LIZ: I’m not doing anything special. I’m perfectly romantic and in love and good and positive and drawing little hearts on pieces of paper every day of the year. So I’ll just carry on with my doodling. But I love Valentine’s Day because you don’t have to give too much attention to it. You can buy a little present, it’s just as good as a big one. I mean, it’s a harmless, wonderful oasis of positivism in a world gone mad.

LESLEY: Don’t you find that men are more romantic than women? I always forget things like Valentine’s Day — romantic times. I find that my husband — and men in general — are much more attuned to this than women are.

CYNTHIA: Oh, Lesley, I want to know the men you know.

LESLEY: Am I wrong?

CYNTHIA: Oh, God, Aaron has just gone up very high in my esteem.

LESLEY: It’s not just Aaron. The idea that men court women, which they do, must come from the animal kingdom. And I do think that there’s some vestigial thing left over from wherever we came from. There’s a courting thing and Valentine’s Day is part of it. No?

LIZ: You mean where the male flares up to show his feathers?

LESLEY: Yes, that kind of thing. Exactly. I do. I don’t think women are romantic.

CYNTHIA: Really?

LESLEY: Are you romantic?

CYNTHIA: Oh, I’m very romantic. Well, I’m not involved right at the moment, so I’m not … I’m going to see my mother for Valentine’s Day, which is a different kind of heart trip.

LIZ: Oh, that’s sweet.

CYNTHIA: But with my son Spencer, so that’ll be fun. But you know, in the past I must say that I’ve had to drop an awful lot of hints that Valentine’s Day was coming in order to not have a bad feeling, a pouty kind of thing. I guess I didn’t pick very romantic guys. I felt like it was really up to me to plan the candlelight. I notice just from having a ten-year-old boy who’s on the cusp of all of this, I see the girls are much more aggressive with the boys than boys are with the girls. Now maybe that evens out later, but heavens, the boys just seem to be muddling along and the girls are very aggressive.

LESLEY: Well, that’s an age thing. How old is he now?

CYNTHIA: Ten, about 11.

LESLEY: At ten boys think girls are icky, don’t they?

CYNTHIA: And the girls don’t think the boys are — they’re really out there. I mean, heavens.

LESELY: Girls just grow up a little faster.

LIZ: I see something in Lesley’s argument. Valentine’s Day offers a guy a sort of cheap, quick, easy way to be adorable and pleasing, no matter what he does. Just so long as he remembers it, and some of them really come to the fore on Valentine’s Day. One guy in my office never forgets.

Read more about: Holidays, Love, Marriage, Men, Parenting, Relationships, Romance, Shopping, Valentine's Day

47 Reader Comments (so far…) Sign In or Register to comment

Steve, I throughly understand and so enjoy your postings. Also glad that you didn’t take offense to mine. I hear exactly what you are saying with regards to the laws not being as favorable in most states towards men and their children being awarded in child custody disputes. I had a very good friend years ago who was so against her ex having even the remotest rights in seeing their child. She was so bitterly angry with him for disolving the marriage that she couldn’t see the forest for the trees and constantly did all she could to prevent or disrupt child visitations. It got so bad that she was finally ordered by the courts that she would be thrown in jail if she violated the fathers rights any further. I tried to help her to realize that she was going about things the wrong way and that what she was doing was ultimately going to turn the child against her in her wild attempts to keep the child from the father. Sad that it came to the pointshe would be in contempt of court , but sometimes people have to go to bottom before they wake up. She will still call me every once in a while but to this day, she still hasn’t let go of her bitterness. Like I said in my eairlier post, I think it’s fine if both parties are in agreement with just living together as if they really are commited then in a sense they are married and the paperwork is semantics. LOL, stay away from the married ones that’s a foundation built on shaky ground and those types of relationships always fail. Yep, I don’t like the ‘searching for love concept’ either as I find that people who are searching, look desperate. I believe those things of the heart happen when folk’s aren’t looking, they just happen. Where people make their mistake is when they meet people they feel a connection to, they then have a tendancy to close their eyes before they really know who the person is hoping they are the right one. I wish you the same wonderful opportunity I have had the great fortune of finding (when not looking) LOL my husband. I’m sure that someone special is in the cards for you. Thanks for such a respectful posting.

By HA BIBI on 02/16/2009 5:26 pm

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I just joined this site and I found your comments very interesting. It is sad,but true, stereotyping is part of life. The goofy husband who can’t do anything right, the nagging bitching wife, the meddling mother- in-law and good for nothing brother…. it goes on and on. Try and not be so critical… this life is just too short. Be happy, enjoy, and try to do one good thing for someone else everyday. And always thank your higher power, whomever she may be ….LOL!

By Ann Saxton on 02/25/2009 1:43 pm

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This liberal lady just spent the last 2 days celebrating Valentine’s Day. My husband, a Conservative, brought roses, lobsters!, dinner out on Friday night, snuggle time, and even went to a chick flick yesterday afternoon. My liberal lady daughter e-mailed 7 hours ago that she was engaged! We liberal ladies are such losers as you suggest!?! Get over yourself!

By Kris Merrill on 02/15/2009 5:18 am

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Joan —-Let’s face it, women are definitely more romantic than men. We cry at, sometimes, silly things. We can tear up with a wonderful romantic movie. We want our man to say those, oh so correct things to us. And, most of us, would rather hear those words more than once a year. I am a hopeless romantic. I do love to receive flowers —but not just once a year. I do believe a box of candy is a cop out. I do love to receive beautiful cards. But a card, from my honey, is much more appreciated if it’s given “just because”. Not because it’s expected once a year! My husband and I attended the 50th wedding anniversary of friends. When they were re-newing their vows we both looked at each other and both of us had tears in our eyes. You were talking about “watching his eyes” — his eyes were one of the things that attracted me to him so many years ago. And, you are right, when you can see the love there, the memories just come tumbling back. I remembered our wedding day. When I came down the aisle he had tears in his eyes. That’s when I knew that this was the “love” I wanted in my life for many years to come. And, you are right! Take nothing less. Always remember “you know you’re in love when you can’t fall asleep because reality is finally better than your dreams”. —-Dr. Seuss

By Lady Gator on 02/12/2009 12:50 pm

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Lady Gator, Elaine says there is no perfect man. Really, really? Somehow she has missed hearing what we have said and have been saying for months. If “perfect” is no flaws that I have ever seen or you have ever seen, then we must be the exceptions to her rule. I would say that we had high standards from day one, and we weren’t going to “settle”. But in romance, in marriage, it is all in the give-and-take. We understand that - really without actually thinking about it as for us it is second nature and NOT PLANNED (which only rings false from the beginning) — and we WANT to treat each other well. Why wouldn’t we? And to take it a step further - or steps further to be honest - our home life, our love life then reflects in the whole of our lives. And your wonderful Dr. Seuss - of all things - quote? Well, it is perfection … as usual.

By joan larsen on 02/12/2009 2:02 pm

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Joan —- Oh, my lord — I was never one to “settle” for anything! In my years of dating, before marriage, I had to kiss a lot of frogs before the “prince” came along. I wanted someone who was definitely comfortable in his own skin, who respected women and their opinions, even though they weren’t his. And, someone who loved me in spite of myself. And I wanted him to respect me for my independent nature. And, I wanted it to be a two-way street. I wanted to offer those same traits to the person I wanted to spend my entire life loving, needing, and respecting. Some women and men, for that matter, think that marriage is “we must do everything together and be one in everything” - that is just so much chatter as far as I’m concerned. He doesn’t like to shop - great! because I don’t want to sit in a boat all afternoon waiting for that fish, who, in my case, never seems to materialize. Thank heavens tor the differences. I respect his need to mingle with the “boys” on occasion, just as he knows my need to “shop till I drop” with friends. Viva la difference. Do I have any regrets? NO! I surely wasn’t going to settle for second best — so I just love the one I CHOSE - not “love the one you’re with”! And, I love the laughter, to me it’s more important than hearing “I love you” fifteen times a day. I’d rather read his eyes when he says, “You make me laugh every day of my life”. I had to read the quote from Dr. Seuss several times. I couldn’t imagine him saying anything like that? Certainly far removed from “Green Eggs and Ham”. :) I also have another one for you — one of my favorites by Leo Buscaglia —-“Life is our greatest possession and love its greatest affirmation”. Have a nice evening my twin.

By Lady Gator on 02/12/2009 6:55 pm

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joan, you are so wise, as is Lady Gator! Thank you!

By Kris Merrill on 02/15/2009 8:11 pm

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Joan, I think you over analyzed in your assesment of my posting. My Own husband is perfect for me, Highly romantic, caring, kind, generous, highly intelligent, giving, faithful, protective, nurturing, hard working has very devout morals and loves God with all his heart. So these are the things and many more, to numerous to mention, that make my Husband perfect to me and for me. I am all these things to him as well. I have never loved anyone the way I have loved this man. So I would most definately have to correct you on your summation. My posting was completely directed towards women who do not have the slightest idea in how to treat a real man, a man that beholds all the qualities aforementioned, and nothing to do with my own relationship which, is perfect and why, because we both value what it is to truly love another human being. I’m sure that your relationship is wonderful, but please do not assume that yours is the only one.

By HA BIBI on 02/15/2009 10:27 pm

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Sorry, Elaine. I read fast, and took a statement you made that there was no such thing as perfection on page one. “Perfection” jumped out of the page —- which, as you know, has been a long been a personal fun topic of my twin, Lady Gator, and I - with us having some silly fun with it as we do every chance we get. We are fun, we are giggly acting, and we are happy with the choices we have made. My own daughter has been on from the beginning almost also, but you would never guess we are mother and daughter when we go off on a tangent. And you will find no assumption that we are not all in the same boat in our marriage choices — but that two of us - of all those I know - produce the same sparks in our marriages by the same things we do. Identical. Frankly, it is amazing. It is interesting. When two people meet at 17 as we did, I doubt that much thought was given to standards of what we would want for a spouse. . but we both had come from families where the parents were very good matches so, looking back, we had had good examples that we must have followed. I had had all my children by the time I was 22 and heavy into my masters — and yet I was still such a kid. But you are so resilient when young, able to juggle lots of things with no problem, and what has been the binding force ever since is that we are still silly, and laugh all the time. We lead entirely separate lives outside our home, making us always interesting dinner partners at night with plenty to talk about. Lovely. An interesting added fact. My father-in-law was an admiral in the Navy, a commander at work but a regular person at home. UNTIL he retired … something he did not want to do. As he got older and got feeling he was not in charge as he had been for his work years, he became bossy at home (though we did not see it). After my in-laws’ 60th anniversary, my husband’s mother called us and said she would have to separate. And so, in one of the oddest stories I ever have seen, we moved her to Arizona and her husband stayed put. . and she never saw him again. Sad, of course, but she made a wonderful adjustment and lived long.

By joan larsen on 02/16/2009 2:51 am

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Sorry, Elaine. I read fast, and took a statement you made that there was no such thing as perfection on page one. “Perfection” jumped out of the page By joan larsen on 02/16/2009 3:51 am Joan, Thanks,I had felt that you were implying that I was saying, that no man is perfect, in the sense that they ‘men’ were all imperfect. What I was really stating, was a ‘shout out’ for the good men in this world and the ways in which some women, take advantage of them.

By HA BIBI on 02/16/2009 7:58 am

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Ladies, personally, I think it is up to each and every one of us to “Teach” our sons to be romantic and caring…and, not just on Valentine”s Day!

By Agyness O on 02/12/2009 1:23 pm

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I have a wonderful, caring, giving husband. The problem is that he has a horrible memory for dates— any date— So, we write everything on a big calendar in the Office (our activities, special days, our kids activities, etc) — He really makes the effort and always surprises me — as a result, both of our boys have really learned to be thoughtful little men. I am thankful everyday and I wouldn’t trade him for anything.

By Kel Choate on 02/12/2009 1:32 pm

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If being romantic means listening to someone tell you how wonderful you are, and pleading for the chance to share company or a life with you;then women are more “romantic”. If telling someone how wonderful they are, and how much you want to share life with them, is romantic; then men are more “romantic”.It’s very difficult for the average woman to outright show interest in a man. Men are very simple to figure out. A man will always go to the most attractive woman who treats him well.

By albert miller on 02/12/2009 3:46 pm

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The last woman I tried to date would recieve flowers with candy from me for no reason other than the fact that I thought she’d enjoy them. This is the kind of thing I do when I have a lady friend. But it was shrugged off. Every time. And this holds true to every relationship I’ve been in. Unless it’s on a birthday, V-Day, or an anniversary, the things men do to show their appreciation and affection go unnoticed. At least this has been the whole of my experience. I don’t need a specific date to be romantic. Romance is a lifestyle, not a gesture. Valentine’s Day is a marketing tool and I don’t need a calender to tell me how to love. I could be wrong though.

By Richard Ruiz on 02/12/2009 4:20 pm

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Sorry Richard, but you got scammed by the ‘Mr. Sensitive’ model. My friend, let me give you the secret here, even in front of all these ladies. Always remember the number one rule. ‘He who cares least, wins’. This sounds much more harsh than it actually is. But, it’s true and it has worked extremely well for me. I used to be like you, until I learned this rule. STOP ACTING NEEDY!!!! A woman doesn’t respect a guy who does the whole flowers and candy thing outside of those ‘certain days’. And, don’t over do it on those days. A woman prefers a man who takes charge, makes decisions about the date in advance, don’t be all wishy-washy. Make her WANT to be with you because you’re decisive, a strong person, comfortable in your skin, and has a sense of humor. Also, I’m betting you probably call her alot. STOP THAT!!! Make yourself a challenge for a woman.

By Steve Douglass on 02/15/2009 5:35 pm