Conversation | 11/07/2008 5:00 am

Post-Election Postmortem: Did the Election Help or Hurt Women in Politics?

With Jane Wagner, Joan Ganz Cooney and Marlo Thomas

JOAN: I think it will dismember it; she appeals to the majority of the base. The base is 28 percent of the American electorate. And that means all the intellectuals in the Republican party who have already turned on her will not support her. I think it would be cataclysmic for that party, but I don’t think it will happen. She may try, but my bet is she would not make it. And, of course, four years is a lifetime in politics. We have no idea what … who the country would see as a potential leader by then.

JANE: I don’t think she will last. I think she’ll fade. Or she’ll go back to Alaska. Maybe if she does something stunning there. But she does have charisma. And when I first saw her, I thought she was like Jean Arthur in topsy-turvy versions of her movies, didn’t you? I mean, she seemed to have charm. And her speech, I thought, was so well delivered that I thought she was a star.

MARLO: She is a star.

JANE: She is a star. Exactly.

MARLO: And she’s funny. And she’s brave and she’s bold.

JANE: She is brave. I know.

MARLO: She’s very brave and bold and she seems fearless.

JANE: We want that from a woman.

JOAN: She’s also ignorant and maybe stupid. I mean, many people who know her don’t think she’s terribly smart. She’s quick. She’s a quick study.

JOAN: She has no depth of interest in anything.

JANE: And I think her ambition is what made us turn on her. Her ambition to take this kind of job or to take this kind of position, knowing that she’s not prepared for it, or not right for it.

MARLO: What about Dan Quayle? I mean, he wasn’t qualified or right. I wonder if anybody has the guts to say, “No, I’m not qualified.” Dan Quayle didn’t think he was.

JOAN: He had two terms in the Senate. I don’t think he saw himself as unqualified. He knew the issues a whole lot better than Sarah Palin. He had no presence.

JANE: He couldn’t spell potato and he couldn’t think on his feet

MARLO: But I don’t think he was an overly intelligent fellow. I kind of see them as the same, in terms of the grasp of the issues and ability … well, actually she’s a better speaker.

JOAN: She has a lot more presence. He was never a star. She’s a real star.

JANE: Do you think she tarnishes, enhances or has any long-standing impact on the idea of a woman as a president or vice president? I don’t think she’s helped the cause.

MARLO: I think in the wake of Hillary, Palin’s a non-issue. I just think that Hillary is such a qualified human being, whether you want her for president or not, whether you’re a Republican or Democrat, but she’s a very qualified human being, and held her own on that stage with all those guys, all those men, in all those debates. Sarah Palin could never do that.

JOAN: Yeah, but I think she has moved the needle, as Hillary did. I think it will be far more common, in the future, to have a woman on the ticket if the man is a candidate; that will not be as rare as it has been. And I think both Hillary and Sarah in particular, oddly enough, because she came out of nowhere, whereas we all knew Hillary. She wasn’t exactly the woman candidate. She was “Hillary Clinton.”

Read more about: Election 2008, Hillary Clinton, News, Politics, Sarah Palin, Vote, women

272 Reader Comments (so far…) Sign In or Register to comment

We nitwits skim your comments under whatever name, Suzanne—not expecting anything enlightening, to be honest. If anyone is interested in following Gov Palin’s future endeavors go to www.teamsarah.org.

By Star Lawrence on 11/10/2008 9:56 am

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Pi I love your writing. Well put. I don’t know much about David Axelrod. Rahm Emmanuel is an interesting character. From what I hear he can get stuff done. I read he was holding out for the Speaker of the House job. I guess Obama trusts him, word is that in the Clinton White House, if Clinton did something against his advice, signed a bill or initiated the direction of legislation, Rahm would get Clinton in the newspaper, but make him look like a jerk. Clinton learned never to tell him what he was doing. Rahm is in it for Rahm. It will speak wall to the Israeli’s, because his father immigrated from Israel.

By Frannie Em on 11/09/2008 1:26 am

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I wonder how you can make negative remarks about Rahm Emanuel regarding his behavior in making Clinton look like a jerk? Who do you attribute your remarks to? Where do you get your facts from? Exactly, who, when, how, and where specifically do you know of ANY attributable event in which Clinton was made to look like a jerk because of Emmanuel, and what would be more thrilling would be how you can really tell us how you could read Bill Clinton’s mind and “let us in” as to exactly how you know that Clinton “learned never to tell him what he was doing”? By what inner circle of politics in the Clinton Whitehouse are you connected to this hearsay? Who clued you to this stuff? How do you you surmise that “Rham is in it for Rham”? Naturally as a politician his self interest is healthy, even ordinary for successful politicians. Obviously Obama knows him well and trusts him. I guess you are divined with personal information you won’t share with us that indicates otherwise. And oh yes, that Israel thing. We all know about the Emmanuel family from Chicago. He was selected because he’s trustworthy and capable and can protect and advise Obama. Your remarks mean nothing without specific attribution. Hearsay and gossip or unattributable conjecture.

By mitzi morris on 11/09/2008 5:18 pm

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Mitzi First off, my brother is married to the daughter of a former National Security Advisor. Many of the people that she and my brother knew while in law school (Univ of Virginia) work in Washington, and have worked for democratic (okay Deni) and republican administrations in the White House. Sometimes I learn information that way. I don’t always talk about that information because I don’t feel it is right to do so. In 1992 President Clinton had Dick Morris as a campaign advisor to help him get into the White House. He stated in an interview the other night, that one day Clinton told him something and then he passed it on to Stephanapolous and Emmanuel. The item ended up in the newspaper, Morris got a call from and enraged Clinton yelling “who did you tell?” Morris replied George and Rahm. Pres Clinton proceeded to chastise Morris with “YOU TOLD GEORGE AND RAHM? YOU TOLD GEORGE AND RAHM?” Morris didn’t think it was that big of a deal because they were Clinton’s two closest aides. As his ire was peaking, Clinton responded with “Well, you may as well have just told the world.” Morris’ point was, and he repeated it a couple of times, that Rahm was very good at getting things done, and well connected, but he was in it for Rahm, as well as he is very partisan. If Pres Clinton did something Rahm didn’t like, it would end up in the paper making the pres not look good, Morris expressed it as ‘jerk’. The interviewer grilled Morris on this point and then he sited examples. Give it a couple of days and it will probably be on youtube and you can look it up there yourself. If you watch any of the wide variety of political shows, many times when Rahm’s name is mentioned they give each other knowing glances, agree that he is a wonderful executer of the details, knows the White House already, can get more things done than others, but that he is very partisan, and very into promoting his own career. He didn’t want to be Chief of Staff, he didn’t want to go back into the White House, word was he wanted Speaker of the House, Nancy Peolosi’s job. When in the White House, whether Emmanual protects Obama remains to be seen. That is not my problem, that is theirs. You misunderstand what I was trying to say about Israel. I totally screwed the sentence up, but since you read so much sarcasm into what I was expressing, I will try to make myself clearer. On the contrary. I am glad Rahm Emmanuel’s father was Israeli. Pre-election there were many rumors that between now and inauguration, the Israelis might make a strike on Iran. THat could be disastrous, because then we might have to protect Israel. I am sure the Israelis and the Iranians know Emmanuel is going to be the Chief of Staff and his father was Israeli, and it may make a difference in what goes on over there in terms of maintaining a stable situation. Or the Iranians could read it as negative. I don’t know. I want the wars to end. My son gets out of the army next June, if Israel and Iran exploded, my son would probably be deployed again. No thank you. After three deployments, he has right to have a chance at a normal and fulfilling life. So maybe you should watch more of the shows from both sides of the aisle, and listen and watch the body language, you’ll be able to keep up better. As well as, now you have set the bar higher for yourself, are we going to get specific attribution every time you post?

By Frannie Em on 11/09/2008 6:29 pm

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very interesting post Frannie Em. were it only that we weren’t in cyberspace. i’d love to sit and have a coffee and hear your stories.

By Buh- Bye on 11/10/2008 10:39 am

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My Alias Actually, I would love to hear more of Star’s stories since she was in Washington for so long and understands how the gears work and who oils them. I bet she has some great stories. Pi, you have a wonderful ability to get a point across. I wish I could do it in as few words as you.

By Frannie Em on 11/10/2008 1:03 pm

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Thanks, Frannie. I know where a few bodies are buried…If you hang around there long enough, you do. I used to date some people I see on the news…that’s funny, me in my funky red-painted floor fam room watching them pontificate and sort of smiling… I also know people who dated spouses of people on the news—I wonder if they knew it was going on. It’s all ancient history. But fun. I aged better than the men, so there! (Even with my fuzzy little head—which I no longer have—so don’t even, Suzanne.)

By Star Lawrence on 11/10/2008 1:42 pm

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Star LOL, I am sure there is so much gossip that it would make my hair curl. All the talking heads are just talking heads, they do the same thing we do here, but they have connections, and are there in Washington. Personally, I think I am fascinated by the system, how people work it, and the “human nature” that influences it. It seems so complex now, and I think that is why it is hard to get a handle on what they are going to do to fix the economic mess. I don’t know. A new administration will begin and hopefully we can move forward.

By Frannie Em on 11/10/2008 2:03 pm

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One day it would be nice to have a smaller chatroom where just we nitwits could confab and hear all of Star’s stories without the background static. :)

By Buh- Bye on 11/10/2008 2:48 pm

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Pi Chatrooms would be interesting, but this format opens everything up. Some of the ladies meet at different blog sites to blow off steam. Star’s stories would be a great start. Well Pi, the page is turning and the challenges for our nation are going to be great. I guess we need to hold on tight because it is going to be a bumpy ride. Someday there will be a woman as POTUS. I just wish they would put more women on the economic problem, it was mostly men that got us here. I heard AIG is now seeking more money for their bailout. We the people, are caught between a rock and a hard spot, and now will own interest in AIG. If it is our money, do we get to vote on decisions made about all of these companies and banks? Aren’t we shareholders now? Do we get to go to the meetings? The credit default swaps, as you pointed out last week, put in the hands of greedy children, has almost destroyed our economy.

By Frannie Em on 11/10/2008 6:46 pm

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Frannie Em, Did you see the report on the news this morning (or was it last night) about AIG honchos living it up AGAIN at another resort, and telling resort staff to keep it all on the downlow?

By Buh- Bye on 11/11/2008 4:13 pm

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From the Wall Street Journal on Palin’s profligate spending including on luxury goods for her husband: “The McCain-Palin campaign is over, but Wardrobe-gate lives on. More embarrassing details have emerged about Sarah Palin’s infamous shopping sprees — including even more designer duds, plus sprayed-on tans and fancy underwear. On top of the $150,000 first outlined in Federal Election Commission filings, Palin spent “tens of thousands of dollars” on additional clothing, makeup and jewelry for herself and her family, including $40,000 in luxury goods for her husband, Todd, our colleague Michael Shear reports. The campaign was charged for silk boxer shorts, spray tanners and 13 suitcases to carry all the designer clothes, according to two GOP insiders. “The shopping continued after the convention in Minneapolis, it continued all around the country,” one source said. “She was still receiving shipments of custom-designed underpinnings up to her ‘Saturday Night Live’ performance” in October. Sources said expenses were put on the personal credit cards of low-level Palin staffers and discovered when they asked party officials for reimbursement. Newsweek reports that top McCain aides were stunned by the huge tab, especially after adviser Nicolle Wallace had told Palin to buy three outfits for the convention and three for the campaign trail, with a budget of $25,000; instead, the nominee racked up six-figure bills at high-end department stores. “Wasilla hillbillies looting Neiman Marcus from coast to coast,” a McCain aide sniffed to the magazine. Palin has always contended that she didn’t ask for the extravagant makeover. The campaign previously said the used clothing would be auctioned off for charity; the L.A. Times reports that a Republican National Committee lawyer is headed to Alaska to inventory and retrieve the items still in her possession. Palin even raised eyebrows for what she didn’t wear: In St. Paul during the convention, McCain senior staffers Steve Schmidt and Mark Salter arrived at her hotel room for a briefing and found her wearing nothing but a towel, with a second one wrapped around her wet hair, Newsweek reports. “I’ll be just a minute,” she said, ordering them to chat with the First Dude while they waited.”

By Wine Warrior on 11/08/2008 12:18 am

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I’ve seen all of this, but Gov Palin has not had an opportunity to respond. Maybe it is true, but I think you should look at her previous actions—she sold a govt. plane that she could have kept and she got rid of the governor’s chef. There is no indication that she used Alaskan’s money to do anything like this. And I believe the McCain staff wants to blame her for losing the campaign. These people aren’t perfect and they are upset that they lost. We are only getting one side of the story right now.

By Susan Easterday on 11/08/2008 8:46 am

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I never quite understood why they kept calling Todd the First Dude. Wouldn’t he have been the Second Dude? Also, will the fancy underwear be donated to charity as well? If so, eww.

By Cynthia Ceilan on 11/08/2008 2:12 pm

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I’m welcomed to see that there are some women on this site that appreciate Sarah Palin for who she was and what she brought to the table. Was she the most experienced candidate? No. But neither was Barack Obama—Hillary beat him on that. Either way, a lot of liked her, thought she brought a lot of common sense to WA and (we’ll see) will have a career in national policitics. The good news is she now has time to go home, be a good governor (remember she had a 80% approval rating), win a second term there, learn a lot more and come back qualified.

By Susan Easterday on 11/08/2008 8:40 am