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Question of the Day | 10/13/2009 4:00 am

To ensure that there are no safe havens for terrorists, would you support keeping troops in Afghanistan for the next five years?

Liz Smith, Joan Ganz Cooney and Candice Bergen discuss the cost of safety.
© Shutterstock
Liz Smith

Liz Smith | 10/13/2009 12:00 am

Liz Smith Fears Another Vietnam

I don’t know. I want the president to decide this fateful question. I fear we are damned if we do and damned if we don’t. But this is why I voted for Barack Obama and I don’t believe in second-guessing him for the rest of his term and adding to the confusion and hatefulness that is going on. I do fear another Vietnam.

Candice Bergen

Candice Bergen | 10/13/2009 12:00 am

Candice Bergen: Where Are the Terrorists?

Afghanistan? I thought we were shifting our focus to Pakistan. That’s where Al-Qaeda is said to be hanging these days. The Taliban is supposedly no threat to the West. Unless they team up. Which they are wont to do.

Joan Ganz Cooney

Joan Ganz Cooney | 10/13/2009 12:00 am

Joan Ganz Cooney on the Argument of War

I have heard so many smart and knowledgeable people argue both sides of this question that I have no idea what the right answer is. The big question for me always is how many American soldiers’ lives is it worth, not to mention civilians in Afghanistan? That question almost always turns me against the war option.

163 Reader Comments (so far…) Sign In or Register to comment

Lila Kuh

Ha! Ha!  I am not a fan of DHS.  I never did understand the rationale behind lumping all those agencies into the unwieldy, confused, and bloated crowning glory of bureaucratic muddle that they have become.  Starting with FEMA.  They did such a great job during Hurricane Katrina, of course they had to become a major cornerstone of DHS.  As far as I can tell, DHS’s main mission is to astronomically and expensively increase inconvenience to average Americans.  I’m sure they have some plaque somewhere that says otherwise, but I sure can’t tell.

The FBI, now, that is real law enforcement, they do actually contribute to national security, and they have actually brought terrorists - both foreign and home-grown - to justice.

As for Afghanistan - if you give me a mission goal of "establish stability," I can make a definition for stability and set criteria for measuring mission success.  It need not be perfect - just meet some defined threshold beyond which we can reasonably expect that the Afghan government can maintain a reasonable level of security and stability.  Personally - I have long thought that it can really only maintain stability under an autocrat.  That’s why I am not all that keen on pushing democracy there.

By Lila Kuh on 10/13/2009 10:53 am
F P
YOu are so right re Fema, DHS and the rest. 
By F P on 10/13/2009 12:16 pm
Lila Kuh
Oh!  PS, I thought the passengers on the plane were actually the ones who caught the crazy shoe bomber.  If DHS claims credit for that, it’s kind of a gimme.
By Lila Kuh on 10/13/2009 10:54 am
F P
Should have stated arrested, not caught.
By F P on 10/13/2009 12:16 pm
Maizie James

"Those people are still living in the 10th century or earlier.  It’s a tribal situation much worse than Iraq. … Afghanistan is not called the graveyard of empires for nothing." - F P 

 Anyone understanding the complex history of Afghanistan will realize that peace can not be achieved in 5 years or 10.  Other posters have pointed out rational reasons for America’s presence in Afghanistan, yet at what cost of lives to try to insure peace in a region of the world that has never known stability.  I would wager that most veterans of Iraq would ask the question we all [must] ask, "Why are we there?"  And, according to some reports of military men and women who have already served a tour of duty in Afghanistan [witnesses of fallen comrades], many have become weary, questioning whether military intervention is the appropriate.

By Maizie James on 10/13/2009 8:24 pm
Baby  Snooks

Osama bin Laden is very important.  Supposedly the family cut him off.  Supposedly.  In Islam a family cannot go against the wishes, or the will, of the father. And bin Laden shares in the fortune and the income from the fortune.  The only thing worse than a terrorist you cannot locate is a terrorist who has untold millions of dollars, perhaps hundreds of millions of dollars, at his disposal. He has the means to buy a nuclear weapon. So far he hasn’t found one. Be assured he is looking for one. 

He is not the only terrorist in the family.  Two of the sons-in-law in Boston who were whisked off to safety after 9/11 had been convicted of terrorism in Jordan.  Which the FBI knew when they put them on the plane.

By Baby Snooks on 10/14/2009 1:41 am
Callie O
You seem to have a good grasp on this subject, Lila.  And you’re right.  We’ll never be able to control how people in other countries think.  We shouldn’t even want to. 
By Callie O on 10/13/2009 11:45 am
Baby  Snooks

Bin Laden is not important.  The governments that might allow him an operational base are.  

_____________________

He is very important.  Supposedly the family cut him off.  Supposedly.  In Islam a family cannot go against the wishes, or the will, of the father. And bin Laden shares in the fortune and the income from the fortune.  The only thing worse than a terrorist you cannot locate is a terrorist who has untold millions of dollars, perhaps hundreds of millions of dollars, at his disposal. He has the means to buy a nuclear weapon. So far he hasn’t found one. Be assured he is looking for one. 

He is not the only terrorist in the family.  Two of the sons-in-law in Boston who were whisked off to safety after 9/11 had been convicted of terrorism in Jordan.  Which the FBI knew when they put them on the plane.

By Baby Snooks on 10/14/2009 1:37 am
Lila Kuh

Bin Laden is not the wealthy and powerful manipulator he once was.  The US and other countries have done well enough at freezing bank assets and blocking donation sources, that Al-Qaeda is now reduced to begging for money.  Bin Laden’s second, Ayman Al-Zawahiri, has been out beating the bushes for donations and not coming up with much.  So if Bin Laden still has some accessible millions somewhere, maybe he should help out his little buddy by writing a few checks.  But I think you will find he has fallen on hard times.

The Taliban is currently much better financed than Al-Qaeda, and significantly, since 2001, they have bitterly blamed Bin Laden and the Arab fighters for their loss of power (true… but also their own fault since they wouldn’t turn him over when we asked nicely).  What’s good about this for us is that if the Taliban are co-opted back into Afghan government, they are NOT bloody likely to invite Al-Qaeda or other meddling foreigners back to their table anytime soon.

Now, before anyone harps on the current consideration of inviting the Taliban back into the Afghan power circle:  co-opting old enemies back into government is a longstanding and proven method of re-establishing stability, and if done well, can also make allies of former enemies.  Witness:  after WWI, the Allies left the Germans on their own and saddled with war reparations costs in a destroyed country.  Thus followed WWII.  After WWII we got smart and enacted the Marshall Plan with great results for Germany, Japan, and the whole world. On a smaller scale, we did the same after invading Panama in 1989; the Panama Defense Forces were dictator Noriega’s instrument, but those guys - minus the worst-offending leaders - went right back to work as the Panama National Police, and things were normalized within a couple of months.  It was practically seamless.  In contrast in Iraq - Paul Bremer completely disbanded Iraq’s security forces to start over from scratch, barring anyone who was previously a member of the Baath Party - which was pretty much everyone who had any expertise in anything at all. Predictable results.

By Lila Kuh on 10/14/2009 8:15 am
C jay

NO! I do not support the U.S. being in Afghanistan - period! When every other UN nation is equally there (percentage-wise) I might reconsider. Our nationalistic bent is bordering on insane!

(ref: Rose interview on October 2, 2009 with Newsweek writer/researcher)

By C jay on 10/13/2009 8:11 am
C jay
correction:  October 7 2009 (www.charlierose.com) for Richard Engle’s information on Afghanistan and ‘where’ the elements are and "who is" the Taliban, really.
By C jay on 10/13/2009 8:23 am
C Hardy

I am not sure how to answer this question - If it keeps us safe should we keep Troops there - but isnt sending Troops there putting them in harms way so where is the US in that?  Do I feel we needed to go to Iraq, no, but we did…did we need to go to Afghanistan, yes, but should we still be there, Im not sure.  I think there is more threat elsewhere but what are we to do?  Send Troops all over - just fly them from one Country to the next? 

Do I think we should just up and leave - not now - all that will do is open the door for Al-Queda and any other terrorist group to come in and take over - both Iraq and Afghanistan are too un-stable.

I dont like our Troops there anymore then anyone else - but it is the job they signed up to do.  No matter what you say - when they singed the line, this became their job and even to those who signed up for the reserves.  I have friends and family currently in Iraq and Afghanistan so trust me saying those words aren’t easy. 

Do I think Obama should send the Troops to Afghanistan that the General is asking for - Yes and I say that with a heavy heart.  I just get this picture of the Troops there, exausted, tired and looking for support thats not coming from THEIR COMMANDER IN CHIEF…how would you feel? 

Frank you served in Vietnam - how would you have felt if you needed more Troops and knew they werent coming?  Would feel that your President turned his back on you…..

By C Hardy on 10/13/2009 8:36 am
F P
We had 500K troops in Nam and we still didn’t win. Why? We didn’t take ground and keep it.  We didn’t, as we should have, fight a war of counter-insurgency. We didn’t pay attention to how the Brits won in Maylaya against the insurgency there in the 50’s.  We didn’t pay attention to why the French lost in Nam which was a war of insurgency by the Viet-Minh. We fought a war with really no national goals other than a highly dubious theory, the Domino theory which didn’t happen in any case. Afghanistan is a no win situation. Period. Not without 650K troops to  hold territory and destroy the narcotics trade which supports and finances the Taliban and the warlords and Karzai. Now you tell me where are we going to get those troops. And that estimate came from Gen Petraeus and he’s right. And another question:  how is it keeping us safe? Iraq surely as hell didn’t—it created even more terrorists and enemies than we had before. And the same is happening in Afghanistan. I say give the damned area to the Taliban and let them fight the warlords and the narcotics and the utterly corrupt oaf Karzai. It’s not worth one American life.
By F P on 10/13/2009 8:57 am
Scarlett Ohara Mitchell
Well said Frank!! I agree. I think our troops and our money are better served at HOME!! We need to protect our borders and our interests at home. We will never end terrorism, never stop those who hate us, or create democracys in places that are intolerate. As MC Hammer said in a song a few years ago: "Bring our Brothers Home!" (if you have not seen this video, check it out on youtube. I am sorry that I can’t provide the link, but it is worth looking up.)
By Scarlett Ohara Mitchell on 10/13/2009 9:28 am
C jay
I remember the "Tet" F P
By C jay on 10/13/2009 1:32 pm