I worked against Prop 8. I was disappointed when it failed, but I believe it will gradually force the change for equal marriage laws. At the beginning of last week there were 3 suits that the California Supreme Court was going to hear regarding same sex marriage. They are suits against prop 8. I believe they will win again. The evolution of it will happen, but it will take time. It is long overdue, but in time, I believe it will happen. There has to be a steady approach of the presentation of civil rights. As for Hollywood firing people because they believe a certain belief about marriage is wrong. Even if someone gave money to support prop 8, it is none of Hollywood’s business. Clean up your own business before you put your eye on someone else. It makes me laugh. Everyone wants to be Joan of Arc or Martin Luther King, sorry, they can never be replaced. Be yourself, love your neighbor on both sides of the aisle, you will do more good than hating and destroying someone. Work on an individual basis and bring the movement forward. Don’t use your power to destroy people. Get off of your meds and wake up and see the real world. What you put out there is what you are going to get back. There is a vast number of people out there that will boycott movies and dvds, and then people lose jobs. It won’t hurt the rich in hollywood so bad, but all the technicians etc will lose from it. There is a better way. Talk to your neighbors, don’t preach or put down, slowly bring them around. I found most people don’t care. Let them get married is what they said to me, let gays be as miserable as the rest of us. One gay radio commentator said a whole new industry would rise up for gay divorce lawyers. Now we are talking equal rights. Is Hollywood crazy? Hollywood once again wants to be known for black listing? You have got to be kidding? That was a terrible time in our history. It will create more civil problems and discriminatory suits against studio heads, agencies, producers, directors etc. What right do they have to black list someone and destroy their means of survival. It is wrong. I would not want that Karma on my head. It will turn into religious discrimination and freedom of religion is protected by the constitution. Obama doesn’t need the country torn apart at the beginning of his historic election.

Great point Sandbee…..

Thank you for your post, C Hardy. To my amazement, almost all of the Christian commentary on this matter which I have located either implies or directly states that Christians are obligated to use the power to the government to force our ideals on others. I have struggled to locate a biblical basis for such a belief, but have come up empty so far. I am currently writing an appeal to Christians, urging them to explain the matter to me. The following is my current draft. It reflects the same kinds of questions you are asking. I’d love to know what you think. _ _ Many Christians have suggested that we are obligated to vote for the governmental establishment of our religious ideals and morality system: only in so doing can we demonstrate loyalty to God and show approval for his law; some claim that failure to do this amounts to “rebelling against the authority of God”. I am bewildered by the logic of such an outlook. By the same logic, if we tolerate (or VOTE to tolerate) the existence of persons who practice other religions, or if we tolerate (or VOTE to tolerate) atheism in our midst, then we are thereby APPROVING immorality and/or godlessness. By the same logic, tolerating (or VOTING to tolerate) the free expression of opinions which are contrary to our own is tantamount to APPROVING those opinions. If such logic is rational, then it must be an abomination for any Christian to support freedom of speech. Does it make sense for us to believe both A) that “God” is an entity Who grants to us free will [i.e., freedom of conscience], and B) that “God” is an entity Who wants us to harness the power of the government to use as a tool for denying free will to others? How can anyone believe both of these at the same time? The majority of Christian literature on Prop. 8 indicates that God expects us to vote into law statues which use the power of the government to coerce others into conforming to our morality system; we are obligated to do this in order to demonstrate approval for God’s way and in order to demonstrate loyalty to God. Well, based on what? For those of you so persuaded, WHY do you believe God expects this? While I await a response, I am searching for anything in my Bible which might shed some light on the problem. When I open my Bible, I read, “Blessed are the meek, for they will inherit the earth.” [Mt. 5:5] I read, “Blessed are the merciful, for they will be shown mercy.” [Mt. 5:7] I read, “Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God.” [Mt. 5:9] I read, “Faith, hope, love abide, these three; but the greatest of these is love”. [I Cor. 13:13, RSV] Using governmental power to coerce others into abiding by the precepts of our own personal religious practice: is this meekness? Is this mercy? Is this peacemaking? Is this love? I think not. So where, then, is your biblical model? Where are your biblical marching orders to be found? Every personal conviction that God approves of this and disapproves of that is a matter of faith. Faith is a good thing … but love is greater than faith. Any attempt to enshrine religious (i.e., faith-based) convictions in secular law amounts to elevating faith above all other things. But faith is not above all other things. Or so my Bible appears to teach. (Does your Bible teach otherwise?) In your formulation, the issue concerns approving or rebelling “against the authority of God and the wisdom of his law”, but what does this law actually have to say? “He who loves his fellow man has fulfilled the law… . whatever other commandment there may be are summed up in this one rule: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’” [Rom. 13:8-9, NIV] Some people believe that the pinnacle of perfection is to love as God loves, but in precisely what sort of manner is that? “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I tell you: Love your enemies … that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous… . Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.” [Mt. 5:43-48, NIV] It sounds as if God’s tolerance and evenhandedness is central to (if not the very essence of) His perfection, His very nature. As already noted (above), this conception needs no reconciliation with the demands of God’s law. “Love does no harm to its neighbor. Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.” [Rom. 13:10, NIV] “In everything [ … in how many things? Oh, yeah, right … ], do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.” [Mt. 7:12, NIV] If we know nothing else at all, but we know this one thing, then we have the gist of the matter, for this precept “sums up the Law and the Prophets”: if, indeed, we do not wish “to rebel against the authority of God and the wisdom of his law”, then whatever we do had better not violate this precept! “Do to others as you would have them do to you… . If you do good to those who are good to you, what credit is that to you? Even ‘sinners’ do that… . Love your enemies, do good to them … then your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful. Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned.” [Luke 6:31-37, NIV] “You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge the other, you are condemning yourself … Or do you show contempt for the riches of his kindness, tolerance and patience, not realizing that God’s kindness leads you toward repentance?” [Rom. 2:1, 4, NIV] Are we supposed to be marching throughout the land purging the earth of everything (and everyone) that offends our moral sensibilities? “Onward, Christian solders”? In a blog discussion of this problem, a gentleman by name of Gary highlights the ramifications of and the essential nature of this enterprise: “No one likes coercion. No one is transformed by coercion. No one is saved by coercion. No one finds faith by coercion.” Do you agree with Gary, “or do you show contempt for the riches of his kindness, tolerance and patience, not realizing that God’s kindness leads [people] toward repentance?” In one of the best known passages in all of the Bible, an expert in the law tests Jesus with regard to the requirements of the law. You know the story; I won’t bother to repeat it (Luke 10:25-37). There is not a word here about a necessity to force others to conform to our will, nothing at all about the desirability of appropriating the power of government to advance our agenda, as if our approval of God’s law demanded such things of us: why is that, do you think? When one of Christ’s disciples resorted to the use of force on behalf of the Savior (doing God a favor), Jesus might have suggested that this is not what was wanted or needed in this particular circumstance, yet we find nothing of the kind. Instead, He issued a rebuke in the form of a general principle applicable to everyone, everywhere, always: “All who draw the sword will die by the sword.” [Mt. 26:52, NIV] Have we learned nothing? “Have I been with you so long, and yet you do not know Me”? [John 14:9, RSV] Jesus said to them, “In the world, kings lord it over their subjects; and those in authority are called their country’s ‘Benefactors’. Not so with you.” [Luke 22:25-26, NEB] “You are not to be like that …” [Luke 22:26, NIV]

C Hardy: If gay marriage were allowed; how does one know who is truly gay? If a woman is married to a man… her husband cheats on her …she meets a woman with the same situation…should those two women be allowed to marry? A man works down the hall from a wealthy attorney. He finds out the attorney is gay. He plays the part of a gay man, and marries the gay attorney. After awhile he sets it up that he no longer wants to be with him. Under the law you want imposed, this wealthy attorney has to give half of whatever he owns to his partner, never knowing he was taken for a fool. The same could happen to gay women. If you want to be famous in Hollywood, marry Ellen. There are more disadvantaged people in this country we should be worrying about. Gay people make up less than 3% of the population. Blacks only count for 13.5% (40 mil) of the population. Gay people have been holding on to a double digit figure a very long time. It just doesn’t exsist. Gays are a money/power driven special interest group, masquerading as a minority. Gays know this, so they ask for protection from discrimination. Heaven forbid someone makes a gay joke at work. A straight person tells a gay joke to another straight person at work. Two other straight co workers overhear the joke, one decides to use this leaverage to get one of the joke telling straight people fired for discrimination. Gays use discrimination as a fear tactic. Its absolutely terrible. Gays cannot stop preaching that everybody hates them. As for your friends that have been together. If one gets sick, I’m sure his family will be there for him to make decisions. I don’t know if being gay is a sin, I’m not religious enough. Gays shouldn’t feel so bad, bad things happen to good people all the time. I voted for Prop 8. After seeing the way gays have acted after the vote, I’ll always vote the same way again.