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Conversation | 04/27/2009 12:00 am

The wOw Conversation: The Ins, Outs and In Betweens of a Mother's Love

Lesley Stahl, Sheila Nevins, Jane Wagner and Mary Wells speak candidly about their love for their children, their parents love for them and what they’ve learned from it all.
© Shutterstock

LESLEY: I read a book the other day. I can’t tell you who it’s by because I’m going to do a story on it. But the book is about mothers and daughters, written from the daughter’s perspective; and a daughter who is older, not a young woman. The point really is that whether you had a good relationship or a bad relationship; whether you ended up friends or not, the mother relationship is still the most vital, deep, formative, painful – whatever – relationship that any woman has. And that if you’ve had a difficult relationship, and your mother’s still alive, it’s very important that you find a way to resolve it, because it can leave a hole inside you.

MARY: But if you think about it, you’re talking about two women. And two women understand each other better than women and men, because men are a different species altogether. You can get really close to your daughter. You can get into each other’s heads and hearts and stuff because you’re two women who are willing to open up your minds and open up your hearts.

SHEILA: But Lesley, you know, I think there are two relationships with a mother. One is when your mother is living, and you’re maybe not measuring up, and you’re maybe damaging each other in some way, certainly in my case. And there’s a relationship when your mother dies, and you have a child of your own, and you begin to see things about being a mother that you didn’t have the insight to see when you were just a daughter. So I always feel like I’ve had two mothers – one that I lived with, that I fought with and tried to survive with; and then one that I understood after I, myself, was a mother, because my mother had died so very young.

And then you let go and then they come back, and then you hold too tight. So it’s kind of like a seesaw. It’s never the right hold ...

LESLEY: But then when you became a mother it was easier, don’t you think – infinitely easier – to forgive your own mother?

SHEILA: Yes, totally. And to feel sorry that I hadn’t understood how much this connection meant to her. Because I wanted to be free and I wanted to be approved of. And, you know, it’s almost impossible to let go when you are a mother because you love so very, very much. And what I possibly interpreted as possessive and controlling was really just her loving me.

JANE: Trying to protect you, right?

SHEILA: Yes, protecting. And not seeing you grow up. It’s very hard for a mother to see her child grow up, because you become less useful.

JANE: Sheila, Lesley and Mary, some of you have written about your relationships with your children. Mary, I recall, I’ve met your daughter. And I loved seeing how warm and playful you are with each other. Candice, too seems so close to Chloe. My feeling is that you all have good relationships with your children.

MARY: Absolutely true. And I had a terrific relationship with my mother. It’s my father who gave me problems.

LESLEY: Well, what I liked about this book is this daughter, finally, coming to understand how much she, as a child, had provoked her mother into yelling at her, even hitting her. How much the child wanted to get to her mother. And boy, I read the book and was in tears, because I could see myself. Things I didn’t understand until I read the book.

JANE: Isn’t that sometimes just classically developmental? Don’t teenagers have to rebel, just to find their own identity?

LESLEY: But not to the point where you make your mother hit you. I never did that. Did anybody here do that, go that far? This was a girl who was doing it every day. But I just find the subject so compelling for every women. We’re always daughters.

41 Reader Comments (so far…) Sign In or Register to comment

Deena B.

Ms. Dee, my relationship with my mother was a bit more like your own.  I wish I could say otherwise.  We did love each other - I know that - but she had inner demons that got in the way.  She knew it, but was never able to conquer them.  She passed away in 2007, very abruptly, so the opportunity get past all of that will not happen for us.  I do not hold any grudges against her, though, just a sense of sadness.  And she did have some wonderful qualities.  I just try not to lose sight of those.

I have a daughter myself and I will say that there are certain things I did not understand when I was a child that now make perfect sense to me.  I was able to tell my mom that "Ok, now I understand why you were overly protective of me (or so I thought at the time)".  I think my relationship with my daughter is very different in many ways, though.  I have never raise a hand to my child.  My mother and I were not able to talk about many of the things daughters should be able to discuss with their mothers.  I make it a point to talk to my daughter and let her know she can approach me.  She came to me recently for advice and I cannot tell you how good that felt.  So, I think you can learn from the past and be able to give that which you never received. 

By Deena B. on 05/05/2009 8:23 am
Ms. Dee

Dear, Ms. B.  I’m feeling like I inadvertently bad-mouthed my mother, and I certainly didn’t mean to.  We’ve had some strife over the years, but I do feel like that’s all been resolved.  I just look at myself as a daughter and a mother and I’m never certain I’m bringing enough to either relationship, or that either relationship really brings me much peace of mind.  That doesn’t mean I’m not deeply attached to both my mother and my daughter.  I don’t know what I’d do without them.  They both come to me for advice.  It’s just that the bonds seem fairly tenuous sometimes.  But that could be my own demons whirling around.  That’s all I was trying to say.

My parenting style was altogether different from my mother’s, and hers was fiercely opposed to her own mother’s, but — judging by results — I’m not sure any of us got it right.  We all just do the best we can…and keep learning from our mistakes and from each other.  (Except, Mother never makes a mistake and nobody cares what I think…but in theory…ha!)  As long as we all maintain our sense of humor…people can learn to accept each other as we are.  I’m struck more and more how much good and bad co-exists in us all.  And the only balance I can really adjust is my own.

By Ms. Dee on 05/06/2009 11:35 pm
Deena B.
I understand what you are saying and did not really take it as bad-mouthing.  I just wanted you to know that you are not alone in not having had an ideal monther/daughter relationship.  As complicated as my relationship was with my own mother she was my mother and I loved her deeply.  I know she loved me, too.  I doubt that I have it quite right either!  I’m sure my daughter will do some things differently when she becomes as parent.  I think your last two sentences sum it up very well.
By Deena B. on 05/07/2009 7:23 am
Cheryl Mitchell

From birth ‘till the age of four, I thought and believed my mother was my sister (long story) so because of that, we developed a real friendship that lasted until she died.  She was my best friend and I miss talking to her, not being able to pick up the phone and chat about everything and nothing.  My parents went on to have nine children in all, but I never lost my place in her hearth.  I just went on to be mommies little helper.  It felt like playing house.

By Cheryl Mitchell on 04/27/2009 12:08 pm
phyllis Doyle Pepe
Cheryl: Interesting that you wrote "hearth" instead of "heart" because the hearth is often the center of the home––where the heart is.
By phyllis Doyle Pepe on 05/09/2009 12:45 pm
joan larsen

Remember when we were in our 40s, ladies … and what I call "just coming into our own"??  We still couldn’t explain what was happening to us - really put it into words — but didn’t we begin to have the beginning of the drops of wisdom gained from our own lives?  Didn’t we have the feeling that somewhere within us we liked being that independent woman that began to make her own choices and saw a new and perhaps brilliant light at the end of the tunnel that said that life was still before us in spades, ready to be lived?

My own mother had her first and only child - me - when she was close to 40.  Looking back, she was steps ahead of what we think of as our mothers as, while she was always there for me, she and my older Dad seemed to already have lives of their own, independent of being only "Mom and Dad" to me. 

Again, looking back, I think it was expected, accepted, that I too would do well - with no pushing but many opportunities -  but I learned by example.  I was surrounded by many adults, taken to "old people’s homes" to visit so often that I grew up revering old people.  The stories they told alone kept me fascinated.  My mother had a grand education, a social life like I have never had, and worked.  She didn’t talk down to me.  I don’t remember being punished - though there was the time I carved my name with the tine of a fork into their Duncan Phyfe mahonany dining room table that certainly deserved something quite severe that I may have put out of my mind. 

I remember now an idyllic childhood when I was loved - there was no doubt in that - but I was independent at a young age, learning by example I would guess.  It served me well.  My regrets?  Accepting things my widowed mother did for my husband and I in our adult years without enough thanks.  My mother seemed to "want to" … and it took years for me to realize the kindnesses heaped on us that made those first years of marriage and children so much easier. 

And then she was gone … and on a day like today with this topic in mind, I look back and fully believe that, without my realizing it, she had passed on to me the style, the grace, the manner, the "class" that she exemplified.  As for the love, I see it now as shown in ways that said "I care" in such a multitude of situations in adult years that I almost gasp in realizing now what she had done with love and "with grace". 

 

By joan larsen on 04/27/2009 2:23 pm
Livia Jones
I had a difficult, tense relationship with my mother from puberty. Well, she finally got old. She’s no longer motivated to verbally jab at me. She has mellowed perhaps, or maybe it has crossed her mind she might need me down the road. I don’t care how or why though. I always made the decision to hang in there. She gave birth to me and took care of me when I was little and needed her most. Sometimes giving her points for that was the best I could do. And now, in her 70s, my mother has become lovable. At last. 
By Livia Jones on 04/27/2009 5:50 pm
angelyn palmer
m oldest som is having issues with    his grandmother my late husband’s mother his commnt was my dad died we didn’t die sher only attempt to contact them is a birthday crd or christmas card witou a letter or anything we have alway been the ones to ake the phone call or go to see themwhat is a good way to deak with this his younger brother still wants to stay in contact with herhe has wqritten her several letters since he got in trouble and ended up in prison but she haS YET TO WRITE HIM BACK
By angelyn palmer on 04/27/2009 8:22 pm
angelyn palmer

would there be a good way to approah her about this

 

By angelyn palmer on 04/28/2009 3:46 pm
jersey girl
By jersey girl on 05/04/2009 2:55 pm
Chrome Toe

I’ve been talking about this topic lately a lot with some friends and e mail buddies so i’m kind of burned out on it. But for those of you who didn’t have "that" kind of relationship with your mother. you’re not alone. the fact that your female and have a child in no way means your good at it. I think the nurturing mother is in some ways a myth. we’re just people. some of us are nurturing and some of us aren’t. Having done child protective services work i’ve also seen plenty of moms who arne’t just not nurturing but are dangerous or damaging to their children.

With that said… the mother daughter/child bond is still the most important relationship in a life. it forms you in ways that you can’t even define sometimes. even the kids who i’ve known who lived without moms due to abuse and neglect or death… it molds them in ways they sometimes take a lifetime to understand.

By Chrome Toe on 05/05/2009 10:30 am
Frannie Em

Chromie

You said it.  LOL  ;-)  

By Frannie Em on 05/06/2009 2:15 pm
Jeannot Kensinger

Understanding my mother came late in my life. One day I figured it all out, living in your second war, have your husband cheat on you, being left one day without a dime in your purse and a child to raise . All of that could truly be a reason to have a break down and be angry.

Mother was not a happy person and I started to see why. She came out on top of it all, had a fabulous job beating out the men in her accounting department and speaking 5 or 6 languages. Happy? content? not in her vocabulary. Replace that with strict, demanding, no grey areas on anything.

So we were often at odds. She never told me I did something that she was proud of but she would tell her friends that I was fabulous.

I loved her and I miss her still 16 years after her passing. I still wish she would have been able to share and show  unconditional love. 

By Jeannot Kensinger on 05/06/2009 10:13 am
Pro mom

While I was a teen I was rebelious and resentful towards my mother. I expected perfection.

As a young mother I was a know it all. I was sure that my mother didnt know anything at all about raising children.She seemed to get smarter and smarter!

As I have aged I have learned to appreciate my mother and the life she has led and continues to lead. She has a grace and understanding that only "time in the trenches" can teach. I feel blessed that she is my mom and unworthy of her unconditional love.

By Pro mom on 05/06/2009 4:44 pm
julia c
I am 41 and have never gotten along with my mother.  I know she loves me but never felt like she respected my opinions or feelings - typical kids stuff that I feel still applies even at this age.  She is in her 70’s.  I can’t decide if she is old and it isn’t worth trying to improve our relationship or if i should try to change things btwn us.  I have so much resentment built up inside of me i am afraid I will harbor bad feelings for her after her death.  What point do you say it is too late and just let it be.
By julia c on 05/07/2009 4:25 am