And yet the war and the drafts continued. I remember because I faced two drafts after 1973.

To turn the question on it’s side, Let me pose two other questions.

What ads or commercials really draw your attention?

Have any ads or commercials actually influenced your spending?

It works the other way too, Liz. At least it used to. Before the do-not-call list, I used to get calls for the “lady of the house”, or “the wife”. They wouldn’t even talk to me. Click. I wasn’t even married at the time, but some even went so far as to claim they had talked to “her”, or was calling back, or some other lie. Eventually, I got a bit surly about the calls. Funny how they would not leave a phone number when I started offering to take a message.

I think that until there is a formal investigation, this will continue to be a destructive and divisive distraction that the country really, really, does not need.

The “rules” are that US legislators do not, when performing the functions of their elected office, submit to the will of foreign powers, including the Vatican. That would be treason. Catholics are, as you say, free to resign from Congress if they prefer not to leave the Church.

I could try to explain how a Constitutional Crisis works, but in this case it would be pointless.

Identical twins have two parents, unless you want to claim that each twin is the parent of the other - which is what you seem to be implying. A clone, on the other hand, is engineered from a single parent. There are unique moral, ethical, and legal issues surrounding clones. You really cannot see past the DNA, can you?

I never said that I could “find no instances when something is just right or wrong”, that is just you making things up.

The rest of your post shows no comprehension of what I said, and is not worth responding to.

Well, Steve, your opinion of what constitutes an "individual" is just that, an opinion

As I have repeatedly said. And, of course, your opinion of what constitutes a separate life is equally just an opinion.

you have arbitrarily decided when you became an individual

There is nothing arbitrary about it. I have considered it from many angles, not merely biology.

…unless the fertilized egg splits of course, then you essentially have clones

If the fertilized egg splits, you get monozygotic (MZ) twins (aka identical twins). Clones are something else.

By "universally recognized", I meant consensus agreement - everyone agrees. Don’t YOU believe that babies and adults are both individuals/separate human beings/separate "lives"/term du jour?

One major difference between us is that you seem intent on reducing human beings down to single-cell organisms, whereas I think it takes more to be a human being than a few cells of organic material.

I have to disagree with you about the "middle ground" business. Sometimes there is just right and wrong and there is no middle ground.

This sort of absolutism is what is tearing this country apart, because there is no place for it in a democracy. Absolutism is the mark of theocracies and tyrants. Democracy requires compromise, and compromise requires debate.

As I recall, about 200 Taliban prisoners were held in an Afghan prison. They were guarded by Afghans, and freed by a Taliban attack.

Al-Qaeda, or their sympathizers began recruiting from American prisons years ago. I know that at least one attempt in a high-security prison was uncovered a few years ago. If it is still going on, then perhaps I was wrong to assume that the Bush Admin would have cracked down on such recruitment once they found out. The point, however, is that as long as the Gitmo prisoners are kept isolated from the general prison population, putting them in American prisons would have no effect on prison recruitment.

I’m afraid that’s all I got. Hope it helps.

Steve, clearly, I was responding to Lemon Tea’s inquiry.

I chimed in just as you chimed in when Lemon Tea responded to "Kelly in Texas". What’s your point?

It doesn’t matter what the "Vatican" is telling people what to do—most people have minds of their own and will react according to their beliefs.

How does that square with all the people criticizing those Catholics that do not follow church doctrine?

If someone is not happy with the Catholicism, quit.

Better to quit than reform?

When I said that the Vatican is telling people what to do, I was referring to the orders to Catholic legislators of democratic nations, telling them to vote according to church doctrine instead of the will of their constituencies. Whether or not you feel that using the Holy Sacraments as a political weapon is sacrilege, the policy is a direct attack on democracy and representational government. Forcing legislators to choose between heresy and treason creates a conflict of interest that is both unacceptable and unresolvable under the Constitution.

This establishes the foundations of a U. S. Constitutional Crisis. Do not even try to tell me that is none of my business or that there is no substance to it.

Genetically unique, yes. Individual (separate) organisms, yes. “Individuals”, no. I dispute your presumption that your “fact” (opinion) cannot be disputed. I have been unique since fertilization, but I did not become an “individual” until later.

Your child/adult comparison is interesting. As both are universally recognized as individuals (independent human lives), the comparison does not apply. But yes, infants, toddlers, adolescents, juveniles, all have the potential to grow into adulthood - baring death.

No argument with your statement about miscarriages either, although it followed a repetition of your presumption about when “individual” life begins.

If I wanted to talk a slave owner out of owning slaves, of course I would debate him - just as I debate those who advocate reproductive slavery. You really hope you could not have ended slavery through debate? That’s disturbing. The only alternative to debate was civil war. Lack of debate drives polarization, reinforces intolerance, promotes hostility. Not good.

Just as you believe others are wrong, they believe you are wrong. Democracy is about finding a middle ground, a place where all can get along. “domestic tranquility”, as the Constitution puts it.

I’m glad to see you choose to participate. No “assault” perceived, we’re good. :-)